You Know Nothing

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Hi, my name is Igor Kheifets and this is the List Building Lifestyle, the only podcast
which delivers cutting edge conversion strategies from the online trenches straight to
your earbuds. Download the transcript of today’s episode and all future episodes at
listbuilidnglifestylesshow.com. I also invite you to grab a free copy of “The Wealthy
List Builder’s Survival Guide” at listbuildinglifestyleshow.com/survival and now
once again it’s time to claim your List Building Lifestyle.

Jonathan: You are listening to the List Building Lifestyle show. Here is the King
of List Building, Mr. Igor Kheifets.

Igor: What’s up, Jonathan?

Jonathan: Hey I got to give you props, man. You are on episode 100. You did that.
It feels and maybe time is warped for me but it feels like you did that super
quickly.

Igor: Yeah, it does feel like we did it super quickly. In fact, I would like to
congratulate you as well because you are a big part of that.

Jonathan: Well thank you, thank you. You know what’s funny about it is that you
and I have been working together maybe it’s been a year, I don’t know probably
hasn’t been probably half a year but you’ve really ramped up your game. But I was
just recording show 100 with Doberman Dan a couple days ago and that was two years
of work together. You’ve managed to accomplish this in a much shorter time, get
huge guests on your show and I imagine that it’s doing something for either your
business or your ego or you would keep showing up.

Igor: Well, it’s actually for both I would say. We have had tremendous success
with the podcast for raising awareness for better conversions, for better traffic
optimization and it’s been one of the purposes all along of course the other
purpose was selfish to get better customers because some point I was getting
frustrated with the people who sort of expected something for nothing, that looked
for handouts, that were still looking for that quick fix, just give me the best
buyers, give me the best buyers who buy everything right now and never complain
and never refund. As if that thing even exists, honestly.

Jonathan: Good luck. [laughter] Good luck. So Igor what do you have in store for
us on show 100?

Igor: Well, today’s show has been inspired by Stuart Diamond, the author “Getting
More”. A great negotiation book I read where it really kind of brings you back and
forces you to look at the world for what it really is. In fact not really the
world more so the people for whom they really are. Rather than kind of living in
your own kind of box and thinking that if people don’t join my opportunities it’s
because the people are bad not because I did something wrong. So today I want to
talk a little bit about what kind of person do you have to be in order to
influence others to do business with you? What it has to do a lot with is your
ability to show empathy and understanding towards another person. I will read
really quick a quote from the book to kind of illustrate my point. Stuart writes
or should I say Mr. Diamond, it’s not like we are friends or anything but I really
admire his work.

Jonathan: [laughter]

Igor: “Many people think that others who don’t see their point of view are being
thick, stubborn, or unreasonable. It’s not necessarily so. Often the things you
hold so firmly and dearly are invisible to the other person. They don’t exist so
to persuade people with different perceptions. You must start with the notion that
your facts or your ideas, your thoughts and your perceptions aren’t visible to
them. What you see so clearly the other party might not see at all. In psychology,
this mistake is called fundamental attribution error and basically you assume that
everyone else reacts to things the exact same way you do.” So for me, it really
shows up in the form of like clients not really getting why someone would say no
to their opportunity. I had this a lot when I was talking to my VIP clients on the
phone. I still get this occasionally but less so ever since we launched the
podcast because we spoke about this many times. It’s like when someone tries to
join an opportunity or is looking for an opportunity to join, there is a lot of
skepticism and questioning, but as soon as that person joins the program and tries
to get someone else in, they forget about what it feels like to be on the other
end. So when it comes to persuading anyone to do anything, we forget that they
don’t see things the way we see them and what we often would for us is often
common sense and a given for other people, it might not even exist within their
world.

Jonathan: Yeah. [laughter] I’ve been there, done that.

Igor: Yeah, we all have, Jonathan, we all have. So when you’re trying to convince
somebody to join your business opportunity and you’re like “Whoa just look at this
funnel they are giving you, this thing is worth a ton of money.” They might not
even know what a funnel is. They might not even understand why you need a funnel.
They might not even have heard of the concept of a video sales letter and why
video sales letters are so powerful. They might still be stuck in that frame of
mind thinking what if I invest $20 and I will not make that $20 back. Now think
about how big of a gap you’re looking at between someone who understand what
funnels are and is already looking for a good funnel versus somebody who is stuck
far, far behind at those early stages of becoming aware to the possibility of
making money online where they are still worried about losing the $20 because they
won’t get them back immediately. Now how do you go about convincing that person,
that’s a good question?

Jonathan: [laughter] Are you giving the answer away or do we have to buy your
product?

Igor: Oh no, this episode is not about getting the answer to that question. This
episode is making you aware of the huge gap between often where you are and where
you expect your prospects to be. Because you might be enjoying your fifth
opportunity right after six years of going from one opportunity to the next and
not having success. You learned a lot. You know what list building is. You
understand the value of video sales letter. You understand the concept of a team
and why you need one. You seek high quality mentoring etc, etc, etc. Somebody who
tries to join you is still at that place where all they want is a proven,
overnight, get rich quick system. So if you now then talk to them about this
awesome coaching you’re getting with your opportunity that rings absolutely no ñ I
mean this does nothing for the other person. They are waiting for you to say
something completely different and when you say look there is no gimmick get rich
scheme over here, you lose them. So question is then how do you bridge the gap and
help this person realize for themselves that there is no get rich quick scheme
without alienating them and then have them ask the question, okay if that stuff
doesn’t work what am I supposed to look for and then come to you asking that
question so you can explain to them what you look for in a good opportunity. So
again, we are talking about the huge gap between where you are and often where
your prospect is. If you ever find yourself in a situation where you email your
list or you put up a video and you get either no response or get super angry
responses, you’re probably violating this rule of persuasion where you assume that
your market knows or understands something or perceives something to be true just
like you when in reality this is totally not the case.

Jonathan: It’s interesting and it’s one of the reasons that I think podcasting is
working so well for you is because you’re actually doing that in these episodes,
right? You’re educating people. You’re giving them ideas. You’re giving them the
smarter question to ask but not necessarily in a brute force manner, you’re just
planting the seed kind of like inception, it’s in the back of their head and it
grows and it grows until it becomes their idea and then they come to you more
prepared, more willing to buy, more ready to take action.

Igor: Yeah, exactly. This is of course marketing examples. What about real life?
Did you ever try and convince ñ maybe you’ve had an argument with your spouse at
one point that was so obvious to you which wasn’t really obvious to them. I
remember a couple of weeks ago. I really got angry with my wife and I stopped
talking to her. I just didn’t talk to her for like two days.

Jonathan: [laughter]

Igor: A buddy of mine came over and he said, “I notice something is off between
you guys, what’s up?” You know he’s a close friend so I say, “Look at this, we are
in my home office, look at this and I take off my slippers, I show him the bottom
of the slipper and the slipper is grayish, blackish like somewhere in between
black and gray. I’m like look at this. She hasn’t cleaned the house for two
freaking weeks.”

Jonathan: Oh shit.

Igor: I can hear dissent crumbling beneath my feet and I’m getting all upset about
it. Because we live in Israel and I live really close to the desert part. So there
is lots of sand. You kind of have to clean the house often otherwise you’re in a
sand storm. You breathe this stuff. You walk on it. You sleep on it. So it’s
getting disgusting. Ever since hooking up with Dennis a couple of years ago, I
became like a germaphobe. So I can imagine all these creatures kind of eating
through my skin and stuff. I’m telling this friend how mad I am at my wife and how
upset I am. I get super emotional. He’s like, “I can see this is really upsetting
you so did you tell her that you want to her to get with the program and just
clean the house?” I’m like, “No.”

Jonathan: What?

Igor: He’s like, “What? That doesn’t make any sense.”

Jonathan: [laughter]

Igor: I’m like, “Well she is supposed to get it on her own because it’s one of her
things that she is doing in the house. I make the money and I pick Ericka up from
school and so this and we have our tasks that we are supposed to do. One of the
things she is supposed to do is keep the place clean.” He’s like, “I’m sure if you
tell her that you’re really upset about the sand on your slippers and you really
hate breathing this stuff. She will just clean the house.” So essentially what
happened was I snapped at my wife later that day. It was a difficult conversation.
I’m not proud for doing that but after that I recognized the truth in what my
friend told me and the next time it happened because that’s how my wife is. Having
an argument about it doesn’t help so it happens often.

Jonathan: [laughter]

Igor: I just asked her. I said, “Anastasia, the house is really dirt, can you
clean it?” She was like, “Yeah, I’ll do it tomorrow morning.”

Jonathan: Really?

Igor: Yeah, that was it. So I’m just supposed to tell her because she waits for me
apparently to tell her to do it.

Jonathan: You got it good. I have to hire a cleaning lady. [laughter]

Igor: I insisted let’s hire a cleaning lady. No, she said, I don’t like anyone
else cleaning my house. I’m like okay fine than just do it on time.

Jonathan: Yeah, get on a schedule, lady.

Igor: Yeah, get on with Jonathan; he knows how to stick to a schedule. Look wake
up at 4 am and clean the house. No, but seriously. Notice that we had a
communication gap after damn it how long has it been? I think it’s 8 years. I hope
she doesn’t listen to it because I’m not sure. I think it’s been 8 years since
we’ve been living together and we still have communication issues. Imagine how
many communication gaps you might have with a person you never spoke to before?

Jonathan: A stranger.

Igor: A million, two? So how come you’re still surprised when you send them a
pitch for your program and it just doesn’t hit.

Jonathan: Right. You don’t even know what angle, where they are at. That is a good
reason and I know that you do this all of the time but that is such a great reason
for you to spend time in your market daily, talking, listening, finding out where
their head is at because it’s going to be in a totally different place than yours
is.

Igor: Oh yeah, absolutely. If you have the opportunity to connect with your
market, it’s awesome. If you’re just getting started then the market is probably
the people you’re talking to on a daily basis because they are trying to do you
the same thing. So my advice to you is to first recognize that you don’t know
anything about the other person. Second advice is to not assume that you know what
they know, in fact assume you know nothing absolutely nothing then go to work to
find out what exactly or at least approximately what they know based on which you
can then build your infotaining content. Because unless you do it, you could be
writing 100 emails per day, none of them will hit because there is just too big of
a gap between where they are and where you expect them to be.

Jonathan: Good advice there. Could be missing the mark no matter how many emails
you send, dammit man. Now we gotta go do work.

Igor: [laughter] You got it, yeah. I mean think about it. Why would you spend two
years mailing your list and not getting any results if you could just spend a day
or two researching where you’re market is at and then just adjust your marketing
and start getting results from day one? I mean it doesn’t make any sense, right
because logically that’s the way to do it but emotionally what do when we join a
program, we just rush. We rush through it. We just say, you know what I’m not
interested in talking to the people who don’t understand what I’m saying. I want
to talk to the people who are already over here and know the value we provide.
Well you know what, good luck with that. Because most people you’re going to talk
to have no fricking clue what you’re talking about. You’ll have to get down. I
should say not to get down but more so to take a few steps back and align yourself
with where they are at, with the way they see the world, with the way they
perceive business opportunities, with the way, they feel about sharing their dream
with their family. I mean here we are, selling the dream and we tell people, “Hey
join this program and you’ll make a ton of money.” But we forget a lot of these
people while they secretly want to join the program, they are embarrassed to admit
to their loved one that they have this dream that they want to leave their day
job. So how can you convince someone get off the fence if you don’t acknowledge
their present situation? They won’t even listen to you. That’s the thing. That’s
the other thing, they will physically not be able to listen to you or physically
not be able to see your advertising for what it really is unless they feel
acknowledged in that way.

Jonathan: Yeah, there are a couple big lessons there. One of them is and it’s
funny with you being on the other line here but there is a lesson in humility
there, humbling yourself and getting to where they are at and the other lesson
there is meeting your market exactly where they are because you have a certain
view of the world and they don’t have that view yet and you got to get to that
shared view like you and your wife did. I expect you to clean the house and you
better clean it! [laughter]

Igor: Honestly, it is so much easier to communicate with somebody. There is way
less friction, there is more communication, there is more compliance, and you
really find yourself in the situation where you don’t really have to say all that
much anymore for people to be convinced to do business with you. Because they feel
you know exactly where they are, they feel understood by yourself. When that
happens, there is no hostility, there is no skepticism because if I know I’m
talking to somebody who understands the place I’m at, I will then assume they
understand everything else. I will not fight them. I will not see them as somebody
who never walked a mile in my shoes. That’s why for instance when I got married I
got closer with my dad. In that time I got really close to my dad because I then
could discuss all the things that bothered me and kind of got under my skin about
marriage. Every time, I would start talking about one of those things, you would
see him kind of closing his eyes and slowly nodding his head, sort of reaffirming
that yeah, I know, man, I went through the same thing 25 years ago when your
mother and I got married. Then from that point forward, guess who I went to when I
had marriage issues. My dad because he understood me, I could have gone to a
marriage counselor but hey my dad understands me. So I will go and talk to him.

Jonathan: Nice. Alright, so we’re coming close to wrapping up, any closing
statements, Mr. Kheifets?

Igor: Yes, absolutely. Assume you know nothing. I mean I actually got this thing
tattooed on my arm believe it or not. If you follow me on Facebook you’ve seen me
post it about it. I have “I know nothing” tattooed on my arm because Leo Tolstoy
said it’s the highest degree of human intelligence. The smartest people in the
world assume they know nothing. They don’t make assumptions and they don’t lock
themselves into one box. They are smart enough to recognize that other people have
other boxes, that other people see things differently and so that what allows them
to be effective, smart and pretty unstoppable because if you can cater to what
other people feel and think about that makes you into the ultimate influencer.

Jonathan: So it’s safe to say that for listening to this show, you have learned
nothing, you know nothing and you should come back to get some more nothing next
time.

Igor: [laughter]

Jonathan: [laughter] Another List Building Lifestyle show is in the can. We will
be back with you next time.

Thanks for listening to The List Building Lifestyle Show, make sure to subscribe on iTunes
or Google. Play to never miss an episode because who knows just one conversion tactic
we share on the show might double your list and double your business. Download the
transcript of today’s episode and all future episodes at listbuilderslifestyleshow.com and
don’t forget to claim your complimentary copy of “The Wealthy List Builder’s Survival
Guide” at listbuildinglifestyleshow.com/survival . This is Igor Kheifets until next time we talk, have a good one.

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